The fun never ends with Singaporean anime distributor Odex, it would seem.
In the past, Odex has been accused of using fansubs as reference material for subtitles, which leads to better subs than translating off of Hong Kong subs, which they’ve also been accused of. But surely now that they’re going after people for downloading fansubs they would quit doing anything like that, right? RIGHT?
Well, at least ONE blogger thinks that Odex “very heavily referenced” a.f.k’s subs of The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya. I’m waiting to see some shot-by-shot comparisons, but damn.
Oh, also, when Odex offered an olive branch to fansub downloaders– that they cease downloading by a certain date and then won’t be fined –many asked what would happen to those who had already been sent letters requesting money? Well, they’re still being persued, apparently– at least one downloader claims he has actually received a phone call from Odex requesting the money.
Oh, Odex. I’m so glad you’re not American.
Tags: fansubs, odex, piracy, Suzumiya-Haruhi-no-Yuuutsu
September 26th, 2007 at 7:57 am
That’s one scary company…
September 26th, 2007 at 8:04 am
they fucking rock!
September 26th, 2007 at 8:11 am
nothing wrong or illegal by referring to fansubs… if i was a fansubber I’d be mildly honored by it.
September 26th, 2007 at 8:13 am
@omo: who said illegal? I think it’s wrong to take action against fansub downloaders and then use fansubber’s material, though. Either you’re okay with it or you’re against it; you can’t have it both ways without looking like a real dick =P
September 26th, 2007 at 10:50 am
The English dub of the series also seems to use a lot of lines from the afk subs. Kyon’s “super-sized” line sticks out the most, but I remember there being a lot of them.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:10 am
[...] Side-by-Side a.f.k. and Odex Tags: fansubs, odex, piracy, Suzumiya Haruhi no YuuutsuWhen I talked earlier about Odex possibly using a.f.k.’s subs as a reference for The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, [...]
September 26th, 2007 at 11:37 am
@Gia: I think it’s totally OK to refer to fansubber’s stuff and then prosecute people who download fansubs of licensed material. The latter are a bunch of illegal folks, the former is legitimate activity.
And it is totally OK to prosecute people who download fansubs if it happens so that they broke the law Odex is suppose to uphold. That’s what the law is. If you think the law is wrong, you should not really complain about Odex but bring your complaints to the appropriate government.
September 26th, 2007 at 11:42 am
Let me just elaborate a bit: we can all agree that fansubbing has a positive effect to the promotional side of an anime. It may have some down sides (that there are loss sales) but it may be offset by the additional sales generated by free publicity through fansubs.
By using fansub scripts for their own work (hopefully to improve on it–afk’s Haruhi subs are, for the most part, acceptable), it’s really the same thing again. On top of free publicity, these legitimate license holders are benefiting from the fansub itself, and hopefully producing a better final product.
If you want to slam Odex as hypocrites, you are free to, but I take the view that Odex would be true to its values and its own words by doing so. In fact, it’s something fans do. It actually gives them more credibility.
September 26th, 2007 at 1:42 pm
Hmm, I see your point, but I think we’re going to have to agree to disagree. How can you say it’s okay to fansub and not okay to watch fansubs?
I see the distinction between licensed materials and unlicensed, but plenty of fansub groups continue to fansub and distribute materials after a series has been licensed. Odex didn’t go after those distributors– it went after the end-users, the downloaders.
So while I can see your justification, I still think it’s an awfully muddled message to be sending out.
September 27th, 2007 at 2:45 am
Certainly, what Odex is doing(in sending the letters) is legal(only for Mobile Suit Gundam Seed).
However, they, like gia said, definitely are sending out extremely mixed messages.
Technically, fansubs are copyrighted material in terms of the subtitles while the animation itself is owned by the licensees and copyright holders.
So if Odex is going to go after fansub downloaders, and in the process keep on slamming fansubs as illegal, why are they trying to rip-off illegal content?
if i was a fansubber I’d be mildly honored by it.
Not if my product was being used by a company to sue the people I serve and then being ripped-off by the same company for their own profit.
September 27th, 2007 at 6:25 am
@gia: How can you say it’s ok to fansub but not ok to watch fansubs? Of course you can’t say that. And clearly no one is ever prosecuted for both.
People are always prosecuted for DISTRIBUTING fansubs. In the olden days of American fansubbing people would do live subs at anime clubs–no distribution at all! The only legally grey area was making of the translation, but that has a very strong fair use argument as opposed to merely torrenting it or whatever.
September 27th, 2007 at 7:40 am
@omo: If people are “always” prosecuted for distributing fansubs, why aren’t the original groups of subbers being sought? After all, they’re the ones who ORIGINALLY distributed it; they are in effect responsible for every single copy that gets downloaded.
If you want to argue that subbers generally quit after a series get licensed, let me point out that the series they were sending the letters out for include Bleach and InuYasha– which continued to be subbed long after licensing. (People are STILL subbing Bleach.)
September 28th, 2007 at 9:26 am
[...] a couple of things about their coverage of Odex’s Haruhi subs. First, they’re only two days later than the rest of us, and second, they actually cited a blog– the same one I did! This rare occasion must call for [...]
September 28th, 2007 at 11:33 am
Oh, people who sub Bleach and the like are in deep trouble. The difference is that fansubbers like them are well-organized and intelligent, and they are difficult to catch and serve with lawsuits compared to some poor teenage boy who doesn’t know a thing about the “right” way to do internet piracy.
Odex, being a Singapore thing, obviously can’t really sue fansubbers scattered all over countries they don’t sell to, too. Even if they want to, it would cost them more money than they can possibly afford or even make. (Large American organizations like the MPAA can’t even successfully prosecute the likes of them thus far. And they spend millions of dollars on these things.)
It’s irrelevant if fansubbers quit or not. If Odex wants to use someone’s subs, they are legally entitled to it as well as ethically, since ultimately they are charged in producing a good, legal product. For fans and companies alike, fansubs is first and foremost explained away as to grow the anime industry in a new language market. All fansubs are created to help along that process, so any way they can help is fine.
September 28th, 2007 at 11:40 am
The only thing I can really take issue with here is the statement that Odex is “legally” entitled to use fansubber’s work. If ANYone is “legally” entitled to it, it would be the owners of the original works, since a translation is a derivative work– but Odex is NOT the owner, it’s the licensor. So, no, I don’t think they have any legal entitlement to it until a court says otherwise.
Whether they’re ethically entitled is, of course, entirely up to an individual’s ethics and therefore completely subjective. :)
October 1st, 2007 at 3:46 am
[...] Simon Jones catches a post by Giapet, who surveys accusations that a Singapore anime licensor has plagiarized fansubbers’ [...]